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Posted by dpdpdp on 10-05-2006 at02:27:

  RE: conclusion perhaps


Posted by Ron E on 10-05-2006 at08:43:

  RE: conclusion perhaps

I think we're seeing the greatest turn around since Jimmy Carter... in public opinion. Welcome dpdpdp. Still haven't finished the book yet... I will return.
Originally posted by dpdpdp
Thanks Big Dork, that was helpful. I would be more than happy to hear from others with actual information and suggestions.

I have an in at our local art-house cinema, I sleep with events coordinator who just happens to be my wife, and could swing a film fest to go along with the show. Band specific films like the Gene Eugene film and the 77s DVD - I have not seen any of them yet. Perhaps a discussion/Q&A with the band afterward. (Don't worry I won't ask any questions.) The dinner would be an add on for fans. I don't know if the band would go for any of this stuff. As you said it is all about money.

Dean - enough already - I am trying to make something positive of all this shit. Go kick your dog or something.


Posted by Audiori J on 10-05-2006 at15:11:

  RE: conclusion perhaps

Originally posted by dpdpdp
Go kick your dog or something.


I would agree with the suggestions here, book a show if you want to do something constructive and positive. I will give you a little story from my own experience; I booked a show, had a venue picked out that was right across from where their hotel was. I paid for everything and had this set up months in advance. I had advertised out of my own expense, even sent notices to local churches, and hung up flyers in music stores. I knew where I live its difficult to get people to show up for the shows, so I already know I will lose money on the deal. Thats fine. A few days before the show, I traveled to Cornerstone to spend all day for a few days in a very hot, dusty tent selling CDs for the guys so they can pay rent and feed their families. When I got home the venue called and said they had gone out of business. I had about one day to find a new venue. Traveled around but everything was booked for July 4th weekend. Sooooo, I built a stage in our front yard and bought equipment to keep the show from being cancelled. I hung up flyers to redirect people to the show. People did come from other states just to see the Dogs play in a yard. The lighting was inferrior, the stage was bad, we had sound problems, and there probably were mosquettos, and if I remember correctly a large bee hanging around Derri. To top it off, on that tour Mike was sick and in and out of the emergency room all tour. He really should of been home in bed, but didnt want to dissapoint people on the tour.

The point is, don't let the negative crap ruin your enjoyment. Mike played in spite of how he felt, we did the show in spite of the problems. They played a great show in spite of being tired from the Festival. I would book them again when I could afford it in spite of losing money. There were people there that really enjoyed the show in spite of the drive and the problems. They were just happy to get to see the guys, happy for the opportunity. Most Dogs fans are dedicated because they 'get' what these guys are doing. They understand they are true to the message and true to being real. They didnt sell out and go into the ccm pop crap just to make a quick buck. Quite the contrary. The "CCM Ghetto" is flashy, big and financially lucrative.

Someone easily could of gone to our show and wrote a review that said 'the place sucked, it was cheap, bad lighting, Mike was sluggish, etc., etc.' But they might of missed the miracle that it happened at all or the spirit of everyone involved.

"You might not recognize, the truth gets colored by
Wrong things, bad things do disguise
Afraid you might despise the real thing
The real thing whoa-oh
The real thing whoa-oh
The real thing whoa-oh"

"Colored By" Words and Music by Terry Taylor
©1981 Paragon Music Corp./ASCAP

Originally posted by MarkyMark77
And I disagree with the concept of Audiori's post. We are to be constructively critical in the church. It doesn't mean that we're not joyous just because we don't think something was done well. "Iron sharpens Iron." As much as I disagree with dp on most of what he's said, I think sometimes this board (and the church) needs just such an enema!

Actually thats not at all what I am talking about. Scripture teaches temperance, meekness in spirit and self control. Kindness, love, mercy, and joy are the fruits of the spirit. What I am saying is on our own strength we can barely make it through the desert from oasis to oasis. But if the Lord is our strength He carries us through the desert. We still go through them, but he gives us strength. Sure we can falter and search like David, but the goal is to come into a relationship with Christ in which we lean on him more and more. Romans says "If God is for us, who can be against us?"

"A storm at sea, and there sits me in a boat
And there's the Savior standing on the waves
The wind is tossing and turning the ship
But I decide to get out of it
And what do I see?
Could it be... I'm standing on the water?
Now, Jesus smiles and bids me come near
But I say, "Lord, there's a storm out there... I may fall"
He says, "Son, don't take your eyes off me
Look straight ahead and you'll arrive safely"
Then I saw me
Would you believe?... Walking on the water!

Now, things get rough and I look to the right
I'd seen Jesus so plainly, now I've lost sight
I start sinking down
And a hand reaches out to me down under the waves
Once again I know that Jesus saves
It's then I find
Oh, there am I... walking on the water"

"Walking on the Water" Words and Music by Terry Scott Taylor
©1976 Maranatha! Music

Its when we focus on the ups and downs, the waves, the good and bad this world has to offer that we start sinking. Thats when we fail. It may sound cliche' but don't let the devil distract you, enjoy life, enjoy what God has to offer.

Posted by peawinkel on 10-05-2006 at15:53:

  RE: conclusion perhaps

Originally posted by larryl
Originally posted by dpdpdp
It is my hope that their talent and ability will find a wider audience. I think this could be done by

A. Putting as much effort into the collective work as they do on their individual releases.

and i believe they do.

Originally posted by dpdpdp

B. being more selective in where they play so they will be seen by, and taken seriously by, those outside the Jesus-ghetto. dp

again. they play where people will book them. book them somewhere you think they should play, and they will be there. the last few tours, they have been begging for more dates at the last minute.

i don't think they are exaclty turning down the viper club to play a church coffee house.

Did someone say Viper Club?

Posted by MarkyMark77 on 10-06-2006 at11:11:


I'm talking mostly about accountability. There is a vast difference between negativity and criticism. I think it's alright if the band knows what people think, even if it's bad. I love my wife, but if she's doing something stupid, I let her know. And she does the same for me. I wouldn't have it any other way. I don't think criticism is focusing on the ups and downs. If you weren't talking about constructive criticism in that post, then disregard this one.

Most criticism of the band would be opinion, but I don't think we should be afraid. For example, I think some of the fans and you especially are too ensitive about criticism of the band. But I don't like this community less, or appreciate less what you personally do for the band. From what little I know about what you do, you work your tail off for I band I love. I appreciate that. But all that doesn't mean they're immune from criticism sometimes. God will sometimes use it to bring you closer to Him, to do your ministry better, etc.

God is even using dp to accomplish something in the LD community. Anything is possibleSmile

Posted by Audiori J on 10-06-2006 at12:35:


Actually criticism I don't have a problem with. Accountability I don't have a problem with.

"I think it's alright if the band knows what people think, even if it's bad."

Sure, thats why the thread is still here.

"There is a vast difference between negativity and criticism."

Right. If a person focuses on everything bad and lets that ruin their enjoyment I think that is negativity. And especially for a believer, if they focus on the surface perceived bad and miss the message or spirit behind it I think that is defeat.

We sometimes can be like the Isrealites in the desert, 'spit out mana and God sends quail'. We have to learn to be thankful for what God gives us even when its not what we want or how we want it. Miracles can be subtle, we can miss them if on the surface they don't suit our taste.

The question is did the band do something they need to be held accountable for? Or is this just negativity?

Posted by MarkyMark77 on 10-06-2006 at18:25:


The question is did the band do something they need to be held accountable for? Or is this just negativity?
Yeah, of course. I've never seen a bad show with any of these guys. I thought that this thread was just negativity from the start. But it seemed to play out a little better.

Although, when the 77's played in Toledo in 1996, I saw them in Upland, IN the week before. I told Mike I was at the Upland show, and he said, "so, you got to see the real thing." Which I had to concur with. The Toledo show was on a small stage, short set, etc. A good show, but not great, I guess. So, the venue does count for something, especially when it limits what the band can do. I heard later that this was broadcast on the local Christian radio station, which was in the Christian bookstore where they played. I wish I had a copy of that now!

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